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Washington Women’s Heritage Project records, 1900-2000 
University of Washington Libraries Special Collections 
Diana Burgess 
January 23, 1998 
Cassette 4, Side 1 
 
 
Allison Card  00:00 
Tape two of the second interview on January 23, 1998, in Diana's living room. Okay, so you 
guys have just-- you're all broken up with who you're with. 
 
Diana Burgess  00:16 
Jeanne had her three. This is before, way before James was born, and I had Mark, and my sister 
Vicky had her son, Ricky. So there's three sisters. Their marriages dissolved, all living together. 
So of course we would take turns babysitting. And we all basically had a pot that-- when I say 
pot, that's literally. All the money that we had, we basically put it in one big pot, and we shared 
everything. It's funny because I had met my husband, James's dad. I had met him pro-- well, six 
months after Bill and I-- after I finally left Bill, and he realized that I wasn't coming back this 
time. And he and I started dating for two years, then he asked me to marry him, which I did. And 
it's-- I don't know, I'm scared of marriage. I'm scared of commitment, because when-- in fact, we 
had lived together maybe a year and a half, and then we got married, and then he changed, and 
I'm thinking, God, what is this? He started-- 
 
Allison Card  01:43 
--how did he change? 
 
Diana Burgess  01:44 
He changed because he didn't want to work, where he had jobs and he would quit. He wanted to 
stay out all night with his single buddies and run-- chase women, which he did. So bizarre. 
 
Allison Card  02:02 
What was he like when you guys first met and were living together? 
 
Diana Burgess  02:06 
I think what attracted me to him is because he was real muscle, you know? Not because he had a 
great body, but I just felt safe with him. I felt safe. I said, Oh, boy, Bill-- and Bill was like sick-- 
well, Bill was six three, very thin. And Tanko, what was his nickname-- 
 
Allison Card  02:31 
--Tanko? 
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Diana Burgess  02:32 
Tanko is James's dad. He was probably five-- Well, five eleven and he was just manly muscle-
bound body, real small hips, but just solid. And had quite a reputation as being somebody that 
nobody wanted to mess with. Okay. So I felt-- I think that helped too, because I felt secure with 
him. You know, if I was ever going to be at out at a club, I knew that Bill would never say 
anything to me, because Tank would put him in his place. So... But, you know, just trying to 
review my life, I just wonder why people change. Was I too easy? Was I too trusting? Was I too 
nice? What? You know, I blame myself for all this, and I know-- 
 
Allison Card  03:25 
--why do you blame yourself? 
 
Diana Burgess  03:26 
Because I just see people-- I see men leaving me, you know, or... 
 
Allison Card  03:32 
But you love Bill. 
 
Diana Burgess  03:34 
I did. And I left James's dad too. But I'm always asking myself, you know, what could I have 
done different? You know, I make myself the heavy, like it's all my fault. 
 
Allison Card  03:48 
Like, something that, if you wouldn't have done this, they wouldn't have-- 
 
Diana Burgess  03:54 
--yeah-- 
 
Allison Card  03:54 
--ended up becoming what they became. Do you still believe that? 
 
Diana Burgess  03:59 
Um... No, no.  
 
Allison Card  04:04 
What made you stop thinking that way?  
 
Diana Burgess  04:06 
I think coming out here and just having a lot of time to just, you know, to review my life and 
realizing that people realizing that you can't make a man do something that he doesn't want to do. 
And if these guys didn't want to be out chasing women, they wouldn't, you know? I could be 
Matilda the [?hud?] at home with a whipping chain or something. And if they wanted to stay 
with me, they would have, you know, and if not, they wanted to go out and chase women, they 
would have. 
 
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Allison Card  04:46 
Right. 
 
Diana Burgess  04:46 
So, that's kind of what-- you know, I really have to say, going back to school, it's amazing. It's 
kind of opened my-- I don't want to say closed mind, because I've always been kind of the open-
minded, liberated of the sisters, at least that's how I see myself. I think, coming, moving out here 
and eventually going back to school [coughs], it just seems like something triggers in your mind. 
Something connects, opens you up. By golly, I think you just finally to-- you learn to depend and 
to accept your mind if you have to go to school, and not necessarily get A's, but good grades as 
to where you thought you were so stupid. It just kind of gives you self-confident, and you just 
start, I don't know, seeing things as they really are. Just like-- God, here I'm getting ready to 
jump across the fence again. 
 
Allison Card  06:05 
It's alright. 
 
Diana Burgess  06:06 
Why do I keep doing this? It's like-- not that I think-- I don't know. I think the type of man that I 
need in my life, the type of life that I live, I could never find him. I'm not saying that I have to be 
dressed like Saks Fifth Avenue, or, you know, anything like that. It's just, to me, the type of man 
I need in my life. I don't know how quite to attract him, because I need somebody that's very 
intro-- intelligent.  
 
Allison Card  06:37 
Yeah. 
 
Diana Burgess  06:38 
Somebody that I can talk to about world events. You know, I mean-- what am I trying to say?  
 
Allison Card  06:48 
Were you able to do either that with Bill or James? 
 
Diana Burgess  06:52 
No. No, not at all. 
 
Allison Card  06:55 
So you're looking for someone different than [inaudible]-- 
 
Diana Burgess  06:59 
--I think the need that I that I have that's-- needs to be addressed, I need someone to sit down and 
just talk intelligently about a whole lot of different stuff, you know? From music to art, from 
spaceships to Sodom [laughs] [?saint?]. I'm just-- I don't know. It would be the first for me, I tell 
you. 
 
Allison Card  07:32 
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Have you dated men like this?  
 
Diana Burgess  07:37 
No, no.  
 
Allison Card  07:39 
No. So you haven't found anyone that fits what you would consider your ideal person? 
 
Diana Burgess  07:41 
Yeah, that's true. I don't want him to be the Pope, but still, you know what I'm saying. It's like the 
type of men I attract are men like Bill, like Tank-- or James, if you want to call him, that seems 
weird calling him James when I call my son James, so I just call him Tank, but um-- and they 
were, not gonna say mother's boys, but they kind of were like mama's boys, you know? They 
needed somebody to take care of them, and I was the substitute mother. I'm sick of that image. 
Say, Well, how can I change that without going to the extreme? I could never do things in 
increments. So it had to be from one extreme to the next. I could never just gradually go into 
something, you know? 
 
Allison Card  08:39 
 Yeah. 
 
Diana Burgess  08:43 
Now, I fizzled out again. So, what else can we talk about, [laughs] God.  
 
Allison Card  08:49 
Um, let me see. 
 
Diana Burgess  08:58 
While my family lived in my-- [clears throat] which is bizarre. I think about things like that, and 
I'm still thinking about that. But yes, I had Mark and James, and this was after I had left my first 
and only husband, and I was trying to get into this computer programming, because that was the 
big thing, you can make good money. And I was always trying to make enough money where I 
could take care of my sons. 
 
Allison Card  09:33 
Were you able to always? 
 
Diana Burgess  09:35 
We kind of would. You know, it was always such that I couldn't take both of them out on payday 
and buy them both something. I had to raise them-- okay, James, [clears throat] Mark's older or 
Mark's tennis shoes are the holiest. He has to get things, and then you'll get yours the next pay. I 
mean, that's like living from payday to payday. 
 
Allison Card  10:03 
Did you ever come across times where it just got really tight?  
 
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Diana Burgess  10:06 
Oh yeah, there was times that I-- it was like, do I buy food for the dog, or do I buy food for my 
kids? So, there was one time, and I'm so ashamed of this, but I mean, it happened. It's the truth. 
And I think about that too, because here my sister lived right next door to me, and all of them 
looked like porky pigs, mother, and brothers, and fathers, all of them was not wanting for 
anything, and all had lots and lots of food, and I did not have anything in my refrigerator. And 
people would say, Well, why didn't you ask your sister? Well, that particular sister, at that time, 
if I asked her something, it would have just went into something confrontational. So I just didn't 
ask, but I was at this grocery store-- [laughs] Oh God, I'm here telling you this, and I remember I 
stole this package of rump roast. 
 
Allison Card  11:14 
Mm-hmm. 
 
Diana Burgess  11:18 
And I took that home, and I fed that to my kids. I don't feel good about saying that, but I-- you 
know, things like that, just-- I don't understand that. I just do not understand that. Or if we was 
invited to dinner, it was like you never really felt comfortable. Like if you asked for seconds or 
you wanted a bigger portion, you just never felt comfortable. I could never-- I just never got that. 
Now that I go home-- [clears throat] this particular sister, she's remarried, and she's like night to 
day, so... I don't know. Allison, I just don't understand things like that, but not within your own 
family. I just don't understand it. So... 
 
Allison Card  12:11 
Did-- were James and Mark old enough to realize what was going on?  
 
Diana Burgess  12:15 
Was like-- I think-- where they were-- yeah, they were both in school. But I think they were 
such-- as it was, they knew that they could depend on me. I would never let it-- let them down. 
Never. I would just do without. Where, if I had to go out and steal another rump roast to feed 
them that following week, I would have done so.  
 
Allison Card  12:39 
What was the most difficult thing you could think of about raising your two sons? 
 
Diana Burgess  12:47 
When I had to make Mark go stay with his grandmother, his dad's mother, because he was just 
out of control. That was very hard for me. It was-- 
 
Allison Card  12:58 
--what was happening then? 
 
Diana Burgess  13:00 
Mark was-- with me? With Mark? With Mark, he was not going to school, starting to hang out 
with the wrong kinds of guys, the kinds that was into drugs, God only knows what else, and I 
knew he was starting down the wrong alley. I kept saying, Mark, you gotta straighten up and 
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straighten up. I'm gonna make you guys stay with your grandmother. And I just kept telling him, 
and kept telling him, and he kept ignoring me, and kept staying out late, drinking, and getting 
loud, and being mean to James, just mean. I just-- I can't-- I just can't even give you an example. 
I just know there was some meanness that I've never seen in him before. And, even when he 
would talk to me, with just how he would answer me, his tone. And he was past the, you know, 
go to your room, or... He was past that, because he was like, a sophomore in high school? 
 
Allison Card  14:14 
Yeah. So what happened then? 
 
Diana Burgess  14:18 
I called and talked to his grandmother, and said, He's out of control. I can't do anything with him. 
He don't want to listen to me, or-- well, they call me Di, Well, Di, just send him on down here. 
So he-- 
 
Allison Card  14:31 
--so she was living in Washington, Pennsylvania, then? 
 
Diana Burgess  14:33 
She was in Westmont. 
 
Allison Card  14:34 
Oh, was it Westmont? 
 
Diana Burgess  14:35 
So he'd go down there, and he'd call, [imitating Mark] Mama, I've changed, I've changed. Come 
on home. He would be home for three weeks and back down to Westmont. So finally, that went 
on about three times, and I just know, You're just going to stay down there. You can come home 
on weekends, and you can come home in the summer. Because-- I said, You're just, I said, 
You're just lying to me. So he stayed down there. He almost didn't graduate, because down there, 
I mean, he got in the same kind of-- he was smoking, you know, that wacky tobacco and 
drinking, you know.  
 
Allison Card  15:18 
How did his grandmother handle him?  
 
Diana Burgess  15:20 
She always was a very firm one. You know, think he was scared of her, so I'm sure she didn't 
know what he was doing, not at all.  
 
Allison Card  15:32 
Mm-hmm.  
 
Diana Burgess  15:32 
But he did graduate, and just like I said he graduated one week, and two weeks later, I was on the 
way out here. But I tried to get him to come out here, and he didn't want to.  
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Allison Card  15:50 
He still has never come to visit Seattle.  
 
Diana Burgess  15:52 
He's never been out here, but when I did-- and you know, it's sad, because the first time I ever 
was able to go home, I had been out here five years, and I went home, and he and I-- forget, we 
had to go someplace. Oh, I know what. We had to go because we were going to a cookout, and 
they wanted us to stop and buy a case of beer. There, you can't get beer in a grocery store, you 
got to go to a distributor. But anyhow. I remember he said, Well, Mom, you know, he says, I 
don't-- I never thought that I would be telling you this, but I'm glad that you did make me go stay 
with my grandmother. And he went on to tell me that the friends that he used to hang around 
with are either dead, they're in jail, or they're just completely strung out on drugs. And he said, 
and I know that I would have eventually ended up in that same in that same situation, 
 
Allison Card  17:00 
So, even though that's the hardest thing you can think of that happened, it was kind of one of the 
best things too. 
 
Diana Burgess  17:05 
No doubt, yeah. Yeah. So now he's-- you know, he's married, and has two beautiful daughters 
that I just love to death. 
 
Allison Card  17:15 
But you don't talk to him much, you said? He's just not talkative--  
 
Diana Burgess  17:18 
--Not him. No, he's not. He's more-- even when I go home, I stay with them, he-- if he's not 
doing something on that computer, he'll be more talkative, you know? But that's just how Mark 
is, right? That's just how he is.  
 
Allison Card  17:41 
How often do you talk with them? 
 
Diana Burgess  17:45 
Sometimes, I talk to them every weekend and sometimes, but generally, twice a month.  
 
Allison Card  17:50 
So you still have pretty good contact with them? 
 
Diana Burgess  17:58 
Yeah. That's good. And James is the complete opposite of Mark, he's outgoing, he has lots of 
friends-- Mark has friends, but not, I want to say, a lot, do you know what I'm saying? 
 
Allison Card  18:15 
Yeah. 
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Diana Burgess  18:15 
He might have a few close friends. 
 
Allison Card  18:17 
A few good friends. 
 
Diana Burgess  18:18 
Yeah, and James has a lot of good friends. They're just like night and day. 
 
Allison Card  18:25 
Do they get along well? 
 
Diana Burgess  18:29 
For James, I think now that James is a man, he won't tolerate Mark, as Mark can, like I said, he 
can [growls] grumping, and James just don't put up with that, you know. And he'll just say, Well, 
hey, that's-- if that's what you want to do, or if that's where you want to go, go ahead. I'm going 
someplace else, you know. But for the most part, they do. They love each other as brothers, but I 
could never see them hanging out, you know, together for a whole night. I just can't see them 
doing that because Mark is so-- he's too laid back for James. Mark would probably rather stay at 
home, drink beer, and watch a movie, or something like that. James might want to go to a club 
or, you know. 
 
Allison Card  19:27 
So they are very different.  
 
Diana Burgess  19:27 
Yeah. They are. They definitely are. 
 
Allison Card  19:27 
I've got some last just couple personal information questions.  
 
Diana Burgess  19:30 
Okay. 
 
Allison Card  19:30 
Do you remember, like names of schools, like the name of your elementary school?  
 
Diana Burgess  19:34 
Yes, one was-- there was actually three, because we moved. The first one was Third Ward. That's 
what they called it, Third Ward, and then Fifth Ward and Clark School. 
 
Allison Card  20:00 
And those are all elementary schools? 
 
Diana Burgess  20:01 
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Mm-hmm.  
 
Allison Card  20:01 
Okay, what about junior high? 
 
Diana Burgess  20:05 
Actually, no junior high. it was just eighth grade through 12, and that was at Washington High 
School. 
 
Allison Card  20:19 
And the colleges you attended? 
 
Diana Burgess  20:31 
Why can't I remember the name of that computer school in Pittsburgh? I can't remember it. I 
cannot believe it.  
 
Allison Card  20:33 
Okay, we can get that next time.  
 
Diana Burgess  20:36 
But of course, I came to Tacoma and went to Knapp School of Business. 
 
Allison Card  20:43 
How do you spell it? 
 
Diana Burgess  20:44 
K-N-A-P-P. I think it's Knapp's. Is it college? Knapp College of Business, 
 
Allison Card  20:58 
Then-- and did you get a degree there? 
 
Diana Burgess  21:02 
No, I got two diplomas.  
 
Allison Card  21:04 
Okay. And then after that? 
 
Diana Burgess  21:10 
Tacoma Community College, and then Green River Community College. 
 
Allison Card  21:20 
And Tacoma Community College or Green River, which did you get your AA at? 
 
Diana Burgess  21:25 
Green River. 
 
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Allison Card  21:36 
Okay, occupations and jobs held? Just kind of more of the major ones. I know you were a nurse. 
 
Diana Burgess  21:46 
Yeah. 
 
Allison Card  21:46 
And that was, what was the name of the hospital? 
 
Diana Burgess  21:49 
Washington Hospital. I don't know, what the name of the college-- [inaudible] here in the state, 
but basically I just have two jobs in this state, because I was working for TCC, and then I started 
working at Green River, doing the same job. 
 
Allison Card  22:19 
And what do you do at Green River? 
 
Diana Burgess  22:25 
Well, my official title is Program Assistant. I'm there to help the part-time faculty, you know, far 
as helping them, you know, this-- room conflicts, I have to find a different room, or there's any 
type of disturbances, other than people fighting and that type, I try to resolve that. But I check on 
the non-credit classes on campus. That is my primary job, and doing payroll. Oh, no, I do so 
much-- 
 
Allison Card  23:18 
--so you're the one everyone goes to. 
 
Diana Burgess  23:20 
Boy, yeah, I get it all. The good and the bad. 
 
Allison Card  23:26 
What about interests or talents? Do you have any special interests? 
 
Diana Burgess  23:38 
I like bicycling. I really like that, which I have not done in probably about a year, two years. 
 
Allison Card  23:51 
Two years? What made you quit?  
 
Diana Burgess  23:53 
Because I had-- oh, these little hoodlums in this complex where I lived. I had my bike in storage. 
And when I went up one spring to get it tuned up, the hoodlums had stole my inner tube. They 
had-- oh, they had stolen so many parts on my bike, I was so mad. It was kind of-- it was an 
antique. It was that a-- I don't want to call it the Radio Flyer, but it was an old antique, you know, 
the only way I want to move if you put some muscle behind it? But they had just-- they had 
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stripped my bike. The chain was gone. I just threw it away. So that was two years ago, and now I 
have-- 
 
Allison Card  24:39 
Have you ever re-bought one? 
 
Diana Burgess  24:41 
I'm going to buy a modern mountain bike. So I'm going to do-- I'm going to do that probably, I 
found out I can lay one away. So spring-- when spring comes around, I'm going to be out. I'm 
going to be motivated, moving or what is it? For lack of better words, I would be back on my 
bicycle. But talent, no, not really. 
 
Allison Card  25:13 
What about clubs or groups? Do you know, or have you ever joined any sort of organization? 
 
Diana Burgess  25:20 
Are we talking all the way to high school? 
 
Allison Card  25:23 
Kind of like a life thing, something that you think back, not like drama club or... 
 
Diana Burgess  25:34 
Mm-mmm.  
 
Allison Card  25:34 
No? 
 
Diana Burgess  25:34 
Mm-mmm. 
 
Allison Card  25:34 
Awards or ribbons, any sort of honors thing? 
 
Diana Burgess  25:40 
No, unfortunately. 
 
Allison Card  25:42 
And do you do any volunteer work?  
 
Diana Burgess  25:44 
No. Mm-mmm. 
 
Allison Card  25:50 
When were you and your husband-- feels weird calling him James after you said that-- married? 
 
Diana Burgess  26:18 
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We were married-- here we go, this is good. July 3, 1970. 
 
Allison Card  26:21 
And where at? 
 
Diana Burgess  26:21 
84, Pennsylvania. 
 
Allison Card  26:22 
And do you know when he was born? 
 
Diana Burgess  26:26 
December 10, 1947. 
 
Allison Card  26:34 
And what was his occupation or lack thereof? 
 
Diana Burgess  26:39 
Like right now?  
 
Allison Card  26:40 
No, then. 
 
Diana Burgess  26:41 
Then? Oh, dear. What was he doing? Gigolo, no, don't say that. [Laughs]. What was he doing? 
Labor, manual labor, I guess you could say.  
 
Allison Card  26:54 
And where does he live now? 
 
Diana Burgess  27:00 
Washington, Pennsylvania. 
 
Allison Card  27:03 
Must be a place-- a nice place to be, if everyone pretty much stays there. 
 
Diana Burgess  27:08 
[Laughs] It's a place where time has forgotten. 
 
Allison Card  27:11 
And you guys had one child.  
 
Diana Burgess  27:12 
Uh-huh.  
 
Allison Card  27:13 
Page 13 of 13 
 
Okay, is there anything else tonight you can think of to talk about? 
 
Diana Burgess  27:20 
Mm-mmm. 
 
Allison Card  27:22 
Alright.  
 
Diana Burgess  27:23 
Just kind of talking circles like [groans]. 